For people who say believing in Jesus is delusional-I have a question?

For millions of people who embraced Jesus and it changed there life


Here a few some say Jesus changed there life.


1. Helped them stay away from drugs


2. Gave people in prison a reason to believe they have forgivness


and can become better people


3. Has given people miracle healings


4. Helps people love and forgive better


5. Helps people daily in life with there exsistence in many ways





If this is all delsuion as some say why would people be better off without this delsuion as you say (Although I say it is the Holy Spirit) what is a better way for a person to love, understand forgive have hope without Jesus?


Rememeber Jesus did ot come to the arrogant but for the humble?


So what is it???

For people who say believing in Jesus is delusional-I have a question?
it's called a placebo. people can do all those things with out an imaginary friend
Reply:It depends on WHAT you believe about Jesus. If you believe he was a good man who taught people how to live in peace and harmony and love one another I don't see anything wrong with that. If you believe he rose from the dead and ascended into heaven, well thats a fairy tale. As far as the list of things you mentioned - you can do the same with an orange. If people truly believe that an orange can make them a better person, then it will. Why do ya need Jesus?
Reply:So it's OK because everyone is doing it? I manage all of the above without Jesus' help, funnily enough, and I suspect quite a few people do.





Are you suggesting millions of people are incomplete enough in themselves to not manage without him?
Reply:Claiming to be a Christian and actually being one are two different things. "Christian" is a word. it what's on the inside that counts.
Reply:Agreed that delusions may indeed help some people have better lives.
Reply:1. I've seen a lot of Christians relapse into drug use.





2. Everyone gets "Saved" in prison, I think it helps them get paroled faster..





3. Miracle healings? I don't believe in miracles. I think this stuff is faked or would have happened no matter what belief system the person has.





4. Helps people love and forgive better? like the wife that shot her cheating preacher husband? Or the lady in texas that cut her kids arms off?





5. Well it does help us in our daily existance, without the SUN there would be no life on earth. Your belief system is based upon ancient sun worship, basic astronomy, and simple astrology, not to mention ancient mystery schools, and a wide assortment of other pagan practices, and teachings before it. It's a fraud just like every other religion in the world light and dark.
Reply:I think it's sad that people cannot take credit for changing their own life... and that they need to believe in some imaginary friend looking after them to make the right decisions.





I'm atheist, I have stayed away from drugs, never been in prison, I am a happy moral person, I always try to do the right thing, I live a very good life and I have done this without JESUS!
Reply:The same can be said about Krishna. Why do you not believe in him?





(That's right, appeal to emotion and appeal to majority are STILL not logical.)
Reply:I've done all of those things (except the prison thing...and my "miracle" healing was not killing myself when I was completely depressed and a total basket case because of the harm done to me by my religious upbringing) with the help of my friends that I can see and touch and hear.





You rely on an imaginary friend that you can't see, and I rely on the ones that I can. You can believe what you want, and I can believe that you're a silly-head.
Reply:I have seen people turn to Paganism and have the same things happen. I have also seen this in many other faiths. Christians do not have these things alone. So if no other faith is real why do they have all christians do.
Reply:no THEY did that...not god. THEY changed their own life. Your own beliefs say that god gives people free will therefore he/it could not interfere, change, alter, hint, etc. in anyway in any aspect of our lives or he would be proving his existance, which would in turn remove the "free will" to believe or not. People would actually see more beauty if they gave themselves the credit for their own actions instead of a mythical figure.
Reply:The problem is that that delusion has worked with many other things that people have believed in .You could easily take Jesus out and put Athena in and it would still work. If it did work with Jesus and not with anything or anybody else then yes you could say that Jesus had something to with it but since it does work with anything that people believe in the positive results cannot be attributed to Jesus but rather to the positive power of self-delusion.
Reply:1. I am a former drug addict and can tell you that in the Narcotics Anonymous meetings I went to it is based on God. After each meeting we'd say the Serenity prayer. Everyone there was looking to hold onto ANYTHING that they thought could possibly save them, and Jesus was the only thing that people thought could help them. Really, there, Jesus was like a placebo effect. When they thought all was lost, the leaders of the meetings would pretty much brainwash the members into believing in Jesus, thus inducing the placebo effect.





2. In prison, pretty much all there is to do is lift weights, play cards, and goto church services. Of course they're going to do all they can to occupy their minds, so why wouldn't they start believing? Once again, brainwashing.





3. Do you mean when Jesus gave people miracle healings in his time? Or in modern times? Most people don't think that the fact that Jesus existed is delusional. They think the opinion that Jesus was the Son of God and died for our sins is delusional. I believe that Jesus was a special guy. But definitely not the Son of God or died for our sins. It seems quite silly to me. So yes, I'm sure it is possible that he could have miraculously healed someone. I think a lot of people could do that, if they simply opened their minds to their more spiritual side.





4. Obviously Jesus isn't doing a good job helping others love and forgive. Have you turned on the news lately?





5. Only people can help themselves. They just use the excuse of Jesus to improve their lives. People think that just because they say they believe in Jesus or whatever, will get them into 'Heaven'. No. People can only help themselves, no matter what is said.


Also, where was Jesus' miraculous help when my mother god cervical cancer, had three miscarriages, and when my father attempted to murder her? Where was Jesus during my drug addiction? Where was Jesus when I had to drop out of highschool because of pre-cancer?


See there. He is only fictional. If he could help me with my existence, then where was he? If he could show me love, then PLEASE do!


Silly concepts Christians have.
Reply:That's just it. Jesus helps people have better lives. Atheists are so miserable, they try to get people not to believe in Jesus because they want everyone to be as miserable as they are.
Reply:"1. Helped them stay away from drugs"


If a belief in the supernatural helps, then good for them. But who's to say they couldn't be helped just as much (if not better) by secular means?





"2. Gave people in prison a reason to believe they have forgivness[sic] and can become better people"


Well, when the system won't forgive them, I guess they would turn to someone who will. But why didn't Jesus make them better people before they committed their crimes? Perhaps they wouldn't have done the crimes, and that would've kept them out of prison. Know what's the best way to stop them from going back to prison once they get out? Give 'em jobs! (A secular solution)





"3. Has given people miracle healings"


Really? When? And please, no anecdotal evidence. Show me a study where cure rates are higher among believers than non-believers. Also, why won't god heal amputees?


http://www.whydoesgodhateamputees.com/





"4. Helps people love and forgive better"


Please explain? Do atheists have a hard time loving others? Does everyone deserve forgiveness?





"5. Helps people daily in life with there exsistence[sic] in many ways"


Details? Are you referring to taking directions on how to live from a ~2000 year old book written by goat herders? Have you read any of the advice in that book? What do you think of the advice it gives on selling your daughter into slavery? Just curious.
Reply:some of us do convert and we dont regret it...comforting to know this life isnt just a waste of time..
Reply:It takes 21 days(3 weeks) to change a habit.
Reply:All those people did it all themselves. They just used Jesus as a crutch and excuse to "give them strength" when it was themselves all along. They needed to focus on an abstract because they don't believe in themselves but rather an imaginary being.
Reply:i love him :]
Reply:Its waht you make of it. I embraced Jesus and didn't feel anything, I embraced Shamanism and I got more out of Shamanism in a week then I got out of Christianity in years!





Shamanism has helped me stay away from drugs and forgive people. Has seriously given miracle healings, not just like once a year like you christians, I'm talking about great healings all the time.





As for your little "gaev people in jails reason"....ARE YOU SERUIOS???? Go to a jail with 1000 people in there, 900 of them are christians! the other 100 are scattered and as how many pagans or shamans you see in there...the answer is a big fat *** zero.





Love and forgive better??? You guys are constantly sending people to hell because they don't follow your ways, I'm sorry that is not love.





And it is delusional, there is nothing, nothing original about christianity except Jesus. Even Angels, Angels date back pre christians! And you guys claim Angel's have wings??? The bible does nto mention angels having wings at all, it is the Egyptions that claim that Angels have wings. Isis has pictures with wings. Another thing stolen from Paganism.





As for the things you learn about Jesus now. A lot could be made up, It was the Nico something councel that established Jesus's connection to God. Also I think he makes a great teacher but in no sense is he a savior.
Reply:Delusions are sent for these reasons, Jesus is not a delusion :)








Isa 66:4 I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them; because when I called, none did answer; when I spake, they did not hear: but they did evil before mine eyes, and chose [that] in which I delighted not.





2Th 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
Reply:75% of Americans are Christian.


75% of the U.S. prison population is Christian.





Faith proves nothing.
Reply:I thought he came for everyone.
Reply:Living your life by certain rules is great...like no stealing ,respect for each other and always be kind to strangers ,help the poor etc. etc. etc. but why do we need some crackpot man in a dress to tell us what we should already be doing as decent human beings. All I see as far as religion goes is the opposite of the above . The cause of most conflict between people is religion. They cant all be right can they ? so the logical answer is than none are.We are in fact just well evolved (in most cases) animals nothing more.No divine creations here.


Religion was created to explain things man did not understand 100s of years ago.Science tells us the way things work , grow , live so why believe ancient story's. I don't need to find my conscience in a book...its right here in my head.
Reply:It has hurt other people, and other religions or none do the same things, so this proves nothing at all. This is circular reasoning that Christians use so often.
Reply:Ok so that is 1/3 the word that believes that. That 1/3 is telling the other 2/3 of the world they are wrong. But YOUR arguement, the number of believers determines its validity. Christianity is outnumbered.


You still loose.


Just be secure in your faith. Why do you care what other people think?
Reply:There were never any healings, without medical intervention, and there is a logical explanation for the rest.





When someone does finally find the ability to get clean it is possible that the meditation from prayer gave them the inner strength they needed. Purely psychological and nothing else.





The whole purpose of the bible was to change lives. Change them by using fear as a means of control. After all, knowledge was a punishable offense.
Reply:1. Therapy and jail made people stay away from drugs


2. 65% of inmates return to prison within a year.


3. Miracle healings are fake, ripoff of poor people


4. Love is something each human being is born with, religion has nothing to do with love.


5. You exist untill you die, Jesus has nothing to do with your existance, read a book and you'll understand, what in your body is responsible for your existance. lets start by thanking Oxygen, and H20.
Reply:I don't think people who believe in your god are delusional, I'd just like to point out that there are millions of people who have done the things you listed without believing in him. Sorry.
Reply:I agree that some don't have the mental capacity to deal with life without that crutch. It doesn't stop the fact that the belief in this being is delusional. Some mental patients would not be able to function without the belief that they are a banana but it doesn't stop them from being any more crazy.
Reply:I am drug free, and happy and love life, and i think it is a delusion, so why wouldn't it be better? it has nothing to do with a god, but if you cant explain it, it must be huh?